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Can't certain kinds of letters be used as references?

I know that Wikipedia frowns on using letters as references. But what about letters written to the subject of an article from (1) a important public figure such as a country's prime minister, and (2) a noted religious leader — both held in general high esteem and respect?

Augnablik (talk) 06:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Augnablik: Welcome to the Teahouse. The reason why Wikipedia frowns on using letters as references is because they're limited in use and don't establish notability as Wikipedia defines it. The examples you've given would be primary sources due to their direct connection with the subject, and one could only state what was written in those letters; any interpretation, analysis, evaluation, etc. on the editor's part is forbidden by the no original research policy and its subsection synthesis.
In short, you can write about the contents of the letter, but not any further in what it means unless you have a secondary source that is reliable that makes such observations.
The question here is: what would your intention in using them be? —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 06:17, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Augnablik. If these letters written by an important public figure such as a country's prime minister and a noted religious leader — both held in general high esteem and respect are worthy of discussion on Wikipedia, then surely these letters have been studied and analyzed by historians. If so, cite the historians. If not, then these letters are not as significant as you think. It is not the job of a Wikipedia editor to decide which primary sources are important and deserving of attention. That is the job of the authors of the reliable, secondary, independent sources that we summarize. Cullen328 (talk) 07:07, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Well, no, the letters haven't been studied and analyzed by historians ... the subject of the article died fairly recently, and although he was notable in several areas, I'm not sure how likely it would be for general historians to delve into them. Historians within the areas in which he was notable, perhaps at some point.

I knew the letters might not past muster, given WP:RS, but I wasn't sure if there were exceptions and that was my question. Augnablik (talk) 16:04, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Augnablik If such letters are published or added to an accessible library or archive collection, they could be used as Primary sources. However, if they remain privately held they cannot be used at all. Roger (Dodger67) (talk) 22:50, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Sub-bullets

I want to format the sub-bullets in an article differently from the main bullets. It's very confusing for readers to see black dots at both levels. But when I go to the bullet formatting, I don't see an option to do this. Am I missing something?

Below is an example in the article of what I'm talking about.

• Lyuli, in central Asian countries.
• Romanlar in Turkey, Turkish-speaking Muslim Roma in Turkey, also called Çingene or Şopar, with all subgroups, who are named after their professions, like:
  • Cambazı (acrobatics and horse trading)
  • Sünnetçi (circumciser), like a mohel

Augnablik (talk) 17:08, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Augnablik. If it is necessary, you can do it with HTML - see MOS:BULLETLIST. But I would urge you to consider whether the information should be presented as a list at all: see WP:PROSE. ColinFine (talk) 17:57, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

If I understand your point here, ColinFine, you mean that because the list has accompanying tex,t it would be better to make the information just plain text, unbulleted — which WP:PROSE suggested. Well, perhaps, though the list in this article is really long. It would be quite a task to unbulletize everything.

Thanks for responding to my question. Augnablik (talk) 12:12, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

What happened with this page and its attribution?

Yesterday I made the page Draft:Jessica Watkins (Capitol rioter) under the name Draft:Jessica Watkins (Oath Keeper) and something confusing happened and it ended up split into two pages and one Jessica Marie Watkins is in mainspace. What is the story behind this? Immanuelle ❤️💚💙 (talk to the cutest Wikipedian) 18:40, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Immanuelle. On 26th at 22:26 UTC, you created Draft:Jessica Watkins (Capitol rioter). Twenty hours later CT5555 created Draft:Jessica Watkins (Oath Keeper), and then five minutes later they moved it to main space as Jessica Marie Watkins, leaving their original draft behind as a redirect.

I suggest the two of you get together (perhaps on Talk:Jessica Marie Watkins) and agree how to pool your work on the article. ColinFine (talk) 18:49, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Jessica Watkins - entirely different person - has a note at top "For the Capitol rioter, see Jessica Marie Watkins". David notMD (talk) 18:52, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

I am not convinced that "rioter" is a WP:NPOV description, but I see no better wording ("Oath Keeper" is incomprehensible to someone who is not intricately familiar with contemporary US politics). Tigraan^{Click here for my talk page ("private" contact)} 12:16, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

account merge

I'm trying to merge two users on wikipedia.org.

After reading as much as I could find, it looks like I have to have someone with Bureaucracy capabilities do it for me. I am pretty sure I have this correct, assuming I need to do a merge.

I'm not even 100% sure there are two users because they are "Todd" (my first name) and "Bezenek" (my second name) and I remember seeing "Todd" in places where I now see "Bezenek", but on some old posts, I see "Todd" on the signature, so it is always possible. I did the obvious thing and searched for "User:Todd" and I find someone who is obviously not me based on their edit history that the search found.

Where do I go and/or who do I need to contact?

Thank you in advance,

Todd Todd (talk) 19:14, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: Your username is Bezenec but your signature shows Todd. If User:Todd is not your account please change the your signature so it is not confused with the other one. In any case, accounts cannot be merged. Just pick one account to use and abandon the other one. Leave a note on your user page saying "This user previously edited under the account of (name)" RudolfRed (talk) 19:37, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Edited, since I read the question better. RudolfRed (talk) 19:41, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: You probably entered "Todd" in the "Signature" field at Special:Preferences in 2021. It has never been your username. You can remove it to sign as your username "Bezenek". You could also enter "Todd Bezenek" to display your full name but "Todd" alone is confusing. There is a user called Todd and Special:Listusers/Todd has thousands of names starting with "Todd". PrimeHunter (talk) 20:34, 27 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello PrimeHunter,

That's a great answer. Thank you.

I have a unique name, so if I use my full name, everyone will know everything I do. But, this is Wikipedia, and the point is to be open, so I'll use my full name.

Thank you for the suggestion. You made it easy to decide. Bezenek (talk) 06:23, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Bezenek: Keep in mind that if people need to ping you, they're going to use your account name, Bezenek, regardless of what you put in your signature. If you would like to change your account name to your full name, you can submit a name change request. User:Todd Bezenek doesn't seem to be in use. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:40, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Tenryuu: Thank you for the suggestion. I'm going to leave it the way it is because I use "bezenek" as a login all over the Web.

I agree with you on the third comma (from your badge.) I also like my periods and commas inside the parens and quotes, although with technical issues where exact values, e.g., passwords or user names, are in quotes, I find it is best to keep the period outside. For this reason, I don't change these things on Wikipedia. I expect the world standard will slowly come to having them on the outside. Todd Bezenek (talk) 23:32, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Looking for tools to fix harv, sfn, and bibliography citations

I am currently going through an article that uses {{harvnb}} and was in rough shape. I've stripped out a bunch of material that had inline citations to Atlantis books. I need to check if I have any short footnotes that have harvnb templates pointed to a full citation that doesn't exist, and I also need to check which full citations are no longer referenced by harvnb or {{harv}}. I feel pretty sure that I've heard other editors do this in some kind of automated way, but I don't know where to look. I don't see any tools to check this out linked from the harv, harvnb, or {{sfn}} documentation. If anybody can point me in the right direction, I would appreciate it, Rjjiii (talk) 03:52, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Answered here: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Help_talk:Citation_Style_1&diff=prev&oldid=1157533013 Rjjiii (talk) 08:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Why is social media very unreliable and non-credible media?

If social media, blogs, forums, wikis, and self-published websites are forbidden to cite on Wikipedia, would you give me a reason why is this unreliable? How much content are in social media altogether? Can you utilize it? 12.139.168.130 (talk) 03:54, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

TL;DR: people can just say unverifiable things on social media. LilianaUwU ^{(talk / contribs)} 03:56, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Social media allows anyone to post anything they want. For example, I can say that the Earth is flat on Twitter. However, that does not mean that is true. Reliable sources need to be correct almost all of the times. Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 11:33, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia gives preference to institutional reporting over individual reporting.

Institutions are easier to rule on and to hold accountable to truthful reporting.

Sources that align with liberal democratic values and do centrist reporting are preferred over sources with a different ideology. Bart Terpstra (talk) 18:40, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Semey Medical University

I am drafting the article about Semey Medical University. I would be thankful if someone can help in this process. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Draft:Semey_Medical_University Ruth Dahle (talk) 14:18, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi, Ruth Dahle and welcome to the Teahouse. Firstly, the article needs references. See WP:GOLDENRULE. Above all, though: the content should be written to reflect what is actually said in reliable sources, rather than saying what you want to say and then hunting around for references to back you up.

You may find parts of Help:Your first article useful. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 14:42, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for reminding me of the importance of adhering to the guidelines and maintaining the integrity of the information presented. I appreciate your feedback and will ensure to incorporate appropriate references in future revisions. Ruth Dahle (talk) 14:52, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Lesser issues: there are no wikilinks to other Wikipedia articles, and we use "Sentence case" not "Title Case" for headings. Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 15:01, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

@Ruth Dahle: Welcome to the Teahouse. The draft written at this time is unsuitable to be on Wikipedia. Aside from the issues Esowteric has pointed out, it is blatantly promotional. The encyclopedia requires that articles be written from a neutral point of view; they should not praise or disparage the subject. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 16:00, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

I appreciate the suggestions and welcome further comments and inputs. Due to my busy schedule with professional work, there may be a significant delay in publishing this Wikipedia page. Consequently, I would greatly appreciate any additional assistance you can provide. Thank you in advance for your continued help. Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I added some basic edits to the page and some edits based on some of the comments in this section. The draft will definitely need some references. There is also now an Infobox on the page, so any details to add for the university will be helpful. A good picture added to the article can be important as a quick search in Commons did not show any images available. Adam MLIS (talk) 23:17, 28 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much. There is a photo of the university here: https://ru.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%9C%D0%B5%D0%B4%D0%B8%D1%86%D0%B8%D0%BD%D1%81%D0%BA%D0%B8%D0%B9_%D1%83%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%B2%D0%B5%D1%80%D1%81%D0%B8%D1%82%D0%B5%D1%82_%D0%A1%D0%B5%D0%BC%D0%B5%D0%B9. How can it be used on this Wikipedia page? Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:13, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Ruth Dahle as the image is on c:commons it can be used directly here. I've added to show you. If was being used automatically in the Russian version from the Wikidata Semey Medical University (Q2324449). Cheers KylieTastic (talk) 13:16, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much for your help. Ruth Dahle (talk) 13:22, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Jabal Sawdah

Hello I am trying to change a name of a page to correct it to the right one, not sure why it doesnt not get validated Nmahmoudi22 (talk) 03:11, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Nmahmoudi22 Welcome to Wikipedia! You cannot change the title because you do not have enough experience. Instead you can follow the instructions here: Wikipedia:Requested moves/Controversial. You place the template on the talk page and then change the text to what is needed. The Tips of Apmh 03:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Nmahmoudi22, as has been pointed out to you, you have a conflict of interest and therefore shouldn't edit the article Jabal Sawda or "move" (retitle) it. Please make any suggestion for the article on its talk page, Talk:Jabal Sawda. -- Hoary (talk) 04:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

The article Jabal Sawda refers to the "Soudha mountains". with a link to Al Souda, which uses the spelling "Soudah". Some consistency would be an improvement. Maproom (talk) 07:04, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Changes have been removed

Hello All,

I spent a lot of time updating changes to a page by adding the correct references based on my research. These have been removed. Can you please advice me on what to do - ignore, keep persisting (it is too time consuming to redo these) or ?

Thanks! UAAMAZ (talk) 07:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Kaikhosru Shapurji Sorabji Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 07:26, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@UAAMAZ Welcome - you should go to the talk page, discuss with the person who reverted the edits (as they said in their edit summary.) The Tips of Apmh 07:29, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the advice. I have written to Esowteric. All best! UAAMAZ (talk) 07:32, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, UAAMAZ, and welcome to the Teahouse. The first thing to note is that your work is not lost: it is there in the history of the article: another editor has reverted it, so you need to reach agreement with that other editor and any other editors who are concerned, but if the consensus is that some or all of your changes are improvements, then the changes are still there in the history and can easily be retrieved.

In fact, if you look at the history of the article, you will see that it was Toccata quarta who reverted your edits, with the comment Rv recent edits (due to some factual errors and consistency issues); please take to talk. So they are directly inviting you to discuss it on the talk page. (I have pinged Toccata quarta here, so they should see this discussion anyway). Please see WP:BRD for background to how this works. ColinFine (talk) 08:32, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks very much ColinFine - I am new to this and am aim is to correct as many references as I can so its a relief to know that my recent edits are still there. Will have a chat with Toccata quarta. All best! UAAMAZ (talk) 08:56, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello!

I submitted a page for review over a month ago. I was wondering if someone else could also review the article and let me know if its good. Also wondering how much longer until it will be approved. Thank you Kennyod (talk) 07:58, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Kennyod. Draft:Clemzy was declined on 5 April 2023 and is not currently waiting for review. Your draft only has two references and both are interviews. They are not independent sources and do not contribute to notability. Your draft needs a major rewrite with much better references. Cullen328 (talk) 08:10, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello. That is not the draft I was referring too. I have submitted another one that is still under review. Kennyod (talk) 08:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello, Kennyod, and welcome to the Teahouse. I'm afraid that the answer to your second question is that nobody in the entire universe knows how long it will take until your draft is reviewed: reviewers, like all editors, are volunteers, and choose what they want to work on. What I can say is that leaving your references as bare URL's makes the draft much less appealing for a reviewer. When a reference is properly formatted, a reviewer can see at a glance the publisher, date, author, title, and form a likely opinion of how useful it will be as a source (that opinion might be wrong, of course, but generally it isn't). With bare URLs that's harder to do.

So what you are saying to reviewers is "I'm not going to make it easy for you to review this, but please will you review it anyway".

I've explained this in order to clarify why I strongly advise you to reformat all the citations: please see WP:REFB. ColinFine (talk) 08:37, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

There are now 21 discrete references; reformatting each of the 21 would take an unnecessary amount of your time and lead to unnecessary bulk. Instead, combine (i) ColinFine's (excellent) advice with (ii) "named references" (explained in WP:REFB). -- Hoary (talk) 08:55, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Yung Willis ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 08:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you very much. I will do that. Kennyod (talk) 08:56, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Kennyod, the first thing any reviewer will do is to check whether the draft establishes that the subject is notable. But none of the first four sources cited is independent of the subject. That's a discouraging start. Maproom (talk) 09:00, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Is it possible for a topic to be notable in one language version but not notable in another?

I ask because there’s a music group that fulfils WP:NMUSIC, is very popular, has reliable sources that report on it and has an article on the Japanese Wikipedia, but I’m afraid it might be rejected for being non-notable if I create an English version because of heuristics and editors not being able to verify Japanese. Zipgyros (talk) 14:19, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Some Wikipedia languages may have much more lax notability than English Wikipedia. However, sources being in different languages is not an issue. Editors who speak Japanese would come to help. Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 14:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

The group has been on the national music chart for Japan multiple times, which fulfils WP:NMUSIC in English. Zipgyros (talk) 14:22, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Zipgyros If you begin by translating the Japanese article, please note the guidelines at WP:TRANSLATE and WP:HOWTRANS. We prefer citations to English-language sources if there are alternatives available but that's not mandatory. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:33, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Completely and utterly lost

Hi Wiki people,

For a newbie, this is definitely the most confusing and complex process I have ever come across. I have no idea if I've done everything correctly to ensure my article is in for review. (No idea why they're called articles when the entire planet calls them pages?).

So I've landed on a page that has a big yellow box at the top that says:

Review waiting, please be patient. This may take 4 months or more, since drafts are reviewed in no specific order. There are 4,744 pending submissions waiting for review. If the submission is accepted, then this page will be moved into the article space. If the submission is declined, then the reason will be posted here. In the meantime, you can continue to improve this submission by editing normally.

Well that's a wonderful surprise, only 4 months!

Anyway, at the bottom of the big header it says:

Warning: This page should probably be moved to the Draft namespace.

What on earth does that mean? One minute the page says review waiting - so I assume I've done something right. But then it says I should move it.

Please can someone help me ensure I haven't stuffed things up somehow - my blood pressure won't cope! 😁

Thanks so much, Jimmy. Santoman (talk) 14:24, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: User:Santoman/sandbox Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 14:27, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Santoman Hello and welcome. The "entire world" doesn't draw much of a distinction between a web page for Walmart and one for Wikipedia, but there is a difference. A "page" has a much broader meaning than an "article". Anyone can do anything on a "page" pretty much, that isn't the case with an article. An article summarizes what independent reliable sources say about the topic, and isn't for the benefit of the topic.

You have submitted your draft correctly. It can take four months or even more, but it could take less. This is because reviews are conducted by a limited number of volunteers in no particular order(there isn't a queue, a list that reviewers pick from based on their own criteria or even none at all).

Draft space is a designated area in which drafts can be created. This can be done in your sandbox too, but draft space is more compatible with the review process for various reasons. 331dot (talk) 14:30, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for your welcome. That's the best explanation I've ever heard and makes complete sense. Coming from a copywriting background I get what you mean. Thanks for that. Great news on the draft - big relief. However, you didn't quite answer that last newbie question, do I need to move my article over to the Draft namespace as it's asking me to do, or just leave it? Santoman (talk) 14:41, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi Santoman it has already been moved to Draft:South Pacific WWII Museum and tweaked a bit. Cheers KylieTastic (talk) 14:44, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks again for your help. i really do appreciate it. Santoman (talk) 14:46, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Santoman You would be wise to remove what we call WP:PEACOCK language from the draft, as that is a red flag for reviewers that the article is being used to promote the museum, something forbidden on Wikipedia, not describe it in a neutral encyclopaedic tone. Please read these linked pages (and they are pages, since that's what we call everything that is not an article). Mike Turnbull (talk) 14:56, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Michael D. Turnbull thanks so much for the tips. I'll definitely fix anything that reads that way. I just have to figure out how you go back in to edit an article and then ensure it stays in the queue for review. Santoman (talk) 15:10, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Editing the draft while it awaits review is encouraged, and can be done by anyone intending to improve it to make it more likely to pass muster. As previously mentioned, articles awaiting review are in a heap, not a queue. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:25, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Santoman And now (29 May) it has been declined, reasons given. Yours to improve and resubmit (do not do the latter without the former). Usually, a resubmitted draft gets taken up by a different reviewer, so that person may have new reasons to decline. Again, not a queue, so could be hours, days, weeks, or sadly, months before next review. David notMD (talk) 18:45, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks for the advice. Based on what everyone has said, I will be rewriting before resubmitting. 61.68.27.150 (talk) 22:38, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Sorry @David notMD I wasn't logged in, so my signature was just my IP address. Santoman (talk) 22:41, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

William E. Sasser Distinguished Flying Cross Medal

Good Morning,

The wiki page regarding the Distinguished Flying Cross Medal is missing a very important individual! William E. Sasser was a member of the U.S Coast Guard. He was awarded the Distinguished Flying Cross Medal for his incredible work during Hurricane Katrina. A great man who deserves to be recognized officially on wiki.Distinguished Flying Cross (United States)#United States Coast Guard 65.99.68.72 (talk) 15:30, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello. The Distinguished Flying Cross is definitely an honor in the U.S. but not a rare one. Tens of thousands were awarded in World War II, for example, and there are about 7,000 living recipients. Wikipedia currently has 1308 biographies of people who received that medal. So, the list in the article includes only the most famous and accomplished of them. There is no Wikipedia biography of William E. Sasser, so he is definitely not eligible for that list. Cullen328 (talk) 16:31, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

How to add a userbox

Hello, and thank you for reading this.Please, May I know, how do I add a userbox to my user page? Thank you!❤️ Flora Tribe 612 (talk) 18:25, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi, Flora Tribe 612, and welcome to the Teahouse. Have a look at Wikipedia:Userboxes for an explanation of adding userboxes to your user page. ContributeToTheWiki (talk) 20:22, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Article Updates on a Slightly Notable Person keeps getting rejected!

FYI

 – Collapsing draft content. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 19:42, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

 Courtesy link: Draft:Eddy Kara

Extended content

Eddy Kara-Sarkissian (born 03 September 1988) is a Canadian political strategist, organizational psychologist, filmmaker, and actor.. He began his filmmaking journey into the independent world directing several student films. He first received acclaim in 2015 for his feature film The Sociopath's Guild, for which he won the Best Director Wreath Award, along with 9 other nominations, at the Montreal International Wreath Awards Film Festival (MIWAFF) Both in 2016 and 2017, he ran for the General Coordinator/President position of the Concordia Student Union where he wanted to improve the healthcare insurance plan to extend it to improve students' mental health . Following his success with 'The Sociopath's Guild', he was selected to be the Festival Director of the Montreal International Wreath Awards Film Festival (MIWAFF) in 2016 up until 2022. He led the festival to transformative changes in the digital space, entering into the streaming sphere way before the COVID outbreak as well as making the voting process more democratic . In 2021, Eddy won the Best Comedy Director award at the New York True Venture Film Festival for his political comedy "No, Mr. Mayor-Part 2" . Late in 2021, Eddy Kara ran for city council in his hometown Dollard-des-Ormeaux, where he focused on not increasing taxes and building a better community during hard times . In the last decade, Eddy has been heavily involved in managing many political campaigns, from provincial to federal ones. This led him to launch his own business Kara Strategies which focuses on business and political strategy . More recent campaigns he has managed were the Quebec Liberal nomination wins in Laurier Dorion and Chomedey. He graduated from Adler University in 2022 with a Master's in Industrial-Organizational Psychology In early 2023, he founded and hosts his political podcast "Our Bottom Line: Views about News" References {{cite web}}: Empty citation (help): Missing or empty |title= (help). https://ca.linkedin.com/in/eddy-kara-94931720a Link to draft: https://en.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Draft:Eddy_Kara&oldid=1157497068

Dreadful2002 (talk) 18:52, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Firstly Linked in, Spotify, .IMdb and their own website are not suitable sources. Theroadislong (talk) 19:08, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Page Title

I am creating a page for a local nonprofit, Atlantic Symphony Orchestra based in Massachusetts. There was a previous Atlantic Symphony Orchestra in Canada, since dissolved. I originally titled my working draft, Atlantic Symphony Orchestra, Massachusetts. The organization has suggested Atlantic Symphony Orchestra, USA would be a better title. I don't seem to be able to edit the title. Can I? Or do I just abandon (delete) the old draft and start a new entry, with the preferred name? Thanks, John JohnJPJr (talk) 19:11, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

JohnJPJr Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. You may leave a note on the draft talk page regarding the title, though the title should ideally be whatever most reliable sources refer to the organization as; the wishes of the organization aren't necessarily relevant. See WP:COMMONNAME. Your draft will need to summarize what independent reliable sources choose on their own to say about the organization and what makes it significant/important/influential- showing how it meets the special Wikipedia definition of a notable organization. It isn't enough to just summarize its activities.

If you are in communication with the organization regarding your draft, please review conflict of interest. If they are compensating you in any manner(not just money or even anything tangible), the Terms of Use require you to make a formal paid editing disclosure. 331dot (talk) 19:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I am in communications with the organization to clarify certain dates and names, not dissimilar to a reporter getting facts for an article. (Yes, I now know the difference but have been a web designer in the past, it is hard to change.) My relationship to the organization is as a paying patron and I am not being compensated in any way. I know the current state of the article is meager and am currently in the fact and source gathering stage. While I have contributed in the past, this is my first create from scratch attempt. Thanks for everyone's help. JohnJPJr (talk) 19:30, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

That will count as a conflict of interest that should be disclosed. It doesn't mean you can't proceed. Typically, articles are created without any involvement from, or even the knowledge of, the subject. 331dot (talk) 19:40, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

I would also suggest that instead of thinking about it as a "page for" the organization, think of it as an article about the organization. There is a distinction there- articles are in no way for the benefit of the subject, and the subject has no more say as to what goes into an article than any other editor. 331dot (talk) 19:20, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

(edit conflict) Hello, JohnJPJr. The current title of the draft is a triviality at this point, and the untimate title of an article can be determined if and when the article is accepted. What is far more important is that Draft:Atlantic Symphony Orchestra, Massachusetts is unreferenced and fails to make the case that this orchestra is notable as Wikipedia defines that term. Please follow the advice at Your first article. Your draft needs a lot of work. Cullen328 (talk) 19:21, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Draft Space vs Sandbox

Hi. Is there a difference between draft space and sandbox, and if so, what is it?Lord Milner (talk) 19:48, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Lord Milner: Welcome. The draft space is specifically for creating a draft of a new artice. The sandbox may be used for that also, but it can also be used to just try out different things. In otherwords, the sandbox use is more broad than draft space use. Check out Wikipedia:Drafts and Help:My_sandbox for more info. RudolfRed (talk) 19:57, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

👍 Thank you! Lord Milner (talk) 21:51, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Lord Milner You might like to know that you can create multiple sandbox pages with different names. I've got loads of them going back years for things I've wanted to work on, but never quite found the time to finish. Nick Moyes (talk) 22:17, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Amending incorrect information

I tried to delete material regarding the creation of the 16 Club. At the moment it says the 16 Club was created in the 19th century. In fact it was created in 1971 by myself and three other students. I don't understand why I can't correct this, please enlighten me. 92.18.222.44 (talk) 20:19, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

You removed sourced information from an article without explanation. It's not enough to say it's "false". If the sources given are in error, please provide an explanation as to why and any sources you have to support your claims. Are you sure you aren't talking about a different club from yours? 331dot (talk) 20:23, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Good day IP editor,

Please note that there was a citation that trumps most things about what you say. We cannot prove who you are on top of that. If you can find another source that says it was founded in 1971, then you might be able to change it. ✶Mitch199811✶ 20:27, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Courtesy - article is The 16' Club. David notMD (talk) 18:54, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Non-free use rationale: Enter Shikari - Anything Can Happen in the Next Half Hour

Hello! I was looking at how to add non-free audio samples, and which pages needed audio samples, so I created a short sample of Anything Can Happen in the Next Half Hour by Enter Shikari, but I'm not sure how to make the n.f. use rationale. Can anyone here help me with this? LOOKSQUARE (👤️·🗨️) talk 20:25, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @LOOKSQUARE! You'll want to upload the file. Use {{Non-free audio sample}} as the license, and for the non-free use rationale, something like this:

{{Non-free use rationale 2
|Description = Sample of "Anything Can Happen in the Next Half Hour", a single by Enter Shikari.
|Source = '''Original publication''': Enter Shikari<br/>
'''Immediate source:''' Spotify
|Author = Enter Shikari
|Article = Anything Can Happen in the Next Half Hour
|Purpose = Sample for infobox
|Replaceability = None available.
|Minimality = Used only for article on song itself, at Vorbis quality setting of 0, and less than 10% of the total length of the song.
|Commercial = n.a.
}}

More details are available at {{Non-free use rationale 2}}. Cheers, {{u|Sdkb}} ^talk 21:13, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

RS

How does one introduce a simple fact ex. Annamarie Tendler is featured on Laur Wheeler's spoken word album Birthday Card, in which she reads the poem, "Well and Good", when the only source is New York Post, and the actual album itself: Amazon Music, Spotify Album, YouTube track listing, Boomplay, KKBox, Tik Tok, etc? Thanks. (The question is not regarding notability for inclusion but whether the content statement is considered null and void solely based on NY Post not being a reliable source.) I'm coat-tailing on this discussion here: [1] about People Magazine. Can't a simple "better source needed" template suffice when it is not contentious, analytical, opinion-based, libelous content? Maineartists (talk) 20:43, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@Maineartists, it doesn't seem that the link to the New York Post is working, at least for me, so I can't see it. But if it follows the guidelines in WP:Reliable sources fits with the source and it has significant coverage then you can add the fact with the citation in the appropriate article if it's notable. ‍ ‍ Helloheart ‍ ‍ 20:57, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello‍ Helloheart & Maineartists! Here's a fixed version of that New York Post link as the one above left the "|access-date" attached. Hope this is of help! LooksGreatInATurtleNeck (talk) 21:07, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks, LooksGreatInATurtleNeck! ‍ Helloheart, it's not content that requires multiple sources. It's merely a stated fact. The track is multi-listed and the story was covered (albeit in the NY Post). The question I have is: should the content be stricken simply because the New York Post is considered a "non-reliable" source? What more sourcing does one need to back such a simple claim? I'm questioning overkill for such a straightforward statement. Maineartists (talk) 22:41, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

Maineartists, if the "album" (CD?) Birthday Card has liner notes (or something analogous) that say that Annamarie Tendler reads the poem "Well and Good", then those are (that is) what I'd cite. (If there's reason to doubt the veracity of the liner notes, it's a different story.) -- Hoary (talk) 12:31, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Hey, Great, Hoary! I never even thought about liner notes! Thank you! Maineartists (talk) 13:42, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

How to remove an abandoned Draft?

For Draft:Flavia Vento, the top banners shows "This is a draft Articles for creation (AfC) submission. It is not currently pending review." Then "...abandoned drafts may be deleted after six months." So my question is: how to delete? Regards, JoeNMLC (talk) 23:53, 29 May 2023 (UTC)

@JoeNMLC: If it has been 6 months since the last edit, you may request deletion using {{Db-g13}}, see the instructions there. RudolfRed (talk) 00:00, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

JoeNMLC, there are bots that automatically tag for deletion drafts that have not been edited in six months. It is not necessary for human editors to do this work. Cullen328 (talk) 00:07, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Cullen328, looks like the 6-months will be June 2, so I can wait just a bit longer. Thanks, JoeNMLC (talk) 00:56, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Oh dear, one might use the sorry history of this article to illustrate how a lot of well-intentioned people devoted increments of time that must have added up to quite a lot -- to the eventual accomplishment of nothing. (But this unusually prolix version might show that machine translation has advanced during the last decade.) Somebody a lot more interested in un personaggio televisivo, showgirl ed ex modella italiana than I am might examine the Italian article: it doesn't look bad. -- Hoary (talk) 09:21, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Problem with Template:Wide image

On Jasmund, a pano isn't appearing correctly and it is making your scroll across the image. Would appreciate some help. PalauanLibertarian^🗣️ 00:22, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

The pano looks fine to me. Can you describe the issue with more detail? Carpimaps ^{talk to me!} 04:52, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

First Article Help

Hi,

I have tried to submit my first article on Wikipedia, however it has been rejected for being bias. I have rewritten it, please could someone help me with what to take out/ add to make the article acceptable before I resubmit. Any advise welcome.

Thanks, Issie

Extended content

Tusker Cars · Type of business: Private · Founded: 2000 · Headquarters: Watford, United Kingdom · Area Served: UK · CEO: Paul Gilshan · Industry: Automotive · URL: tuskercars.com [1] · Current Status: Active Tusker is a salary sacrifice and car leasing provider working in the public and private sectors in the UK focusing on getting employees into Electric Vehicles (EV’s) and Ultra-Low Emission Vehicles (ULEV) [2]. Bought by Lloyds Banking Group in February 2023, the acquisition will support the group’s ambitions to achieve net zero targets by 2050 [3]. Tusker are sole providers of CPC Drive which offers salary sacrifice and car benefit schemes to the NHS and other public sector organisations [4]. Tusker are also founders of EV100, and have pledged to have a fully electric fleet by 2030 [3]. History Tusker was founded in 2000 with the aim of developing the corporate fleet leasing industry by taking it online. Supplying contract hire and lease cars through an online platform with lead investor Smedvig Capital, a London-based venture capital firm [5]. In 2008, the business started offering salary sacrifice car schemes to organisations, the first of which was launched with multinational law firm Freshfields Bruckhaus Deringer [5]. Following becoming a carbon neutral company in 2010, Tusker introduced a Carbon Offsetting Project where they would offset any tailpipe emissions of all the cars they put on the road and even the charge needed for the electric cars on the road against verified carbon offsetting projects [6]. In 2010, Tusker was awarded as sole provider of CPC Drive which offers salary sacrifice and car benefit schemes to the NHS and other public sector organisations. Tusker also developed and now manage an online salary sacrifice and lease car management web portal for CPC Drive [4]. In 2012, Tusker introduced a StopGap car scheme, designed to keep its drivers mobile while they await delivery of their new car [7]. In 2015, following the exit of Smedvig Capital, the company formed a new partnership with ECI Partners [8]. In 2018 Paul Gilshan was appointed as CEO of the company. Previous CEO David-Hosking moved into the role of Deputy Chairman [9]. In August 2018, Kit Wisdom joined Tusker as Operations Director [10]. In October 2018, Steve Barker was appointed as Commercial Director for the company [11]. Recent Years In 2019, Tusker won a place on the Salary Sacrifice Cars and Associated Services Framework, making their salary sacrifice scheme available to more than 70 councils and 40 NHS trusts [12]. In 2020, Tusker partnered with Reward Gateway, the leading global employee engagement company, to offer salary sacrifice car schemes to their clients’ employees [13]. Continuing with their environmental work, on World EV Day in 2021 Tusker announced that they are a net positive contributor to the environment. This comes after 11 consecutive years of Tusker running its business as carbon neutral. Tusker is on track to achieve net zero by 2023 and has surpassed a milestone in offsetting more than 250,000 tonnes of carbon emissions via Verified Carbon Standard programmes in the process [14]. In 2022, Tusker lobbied with the BVRLA on their #SeeTheBenefit campaign working to keep company car tax low on electric vehicles [15]. In February 2023, Tusker was brought by Lloyds Banking Group joining their transport division with the likes of Lex Autolease and Black Horse [3]. Awards · Best Car Benefit Scheme 2021 – WSB Awards [16] · EV Finance & Insurance Award 2021 – Electric Vehicle Awards [17] · Green Apple Award for Environmental Best Practice 2018, 2019, 2021 [18] · Best for Turnkey Car Benefit Solutions 2020 – Business Excellence Awards [19] · Car Benefit Scheme Provider of the Year, 2019 – Corporate Vision Magazine [20] · Best Workplace Car Scheme 2019- UK- AI Business Excellence Awards [21] · Car Benefit Specialist of the Year, AI Business In Excellence 2018 [22] · Innovation in Customer Service, Fleet World Honours 2017 [23] External Sources 1. Tusker's LinkedIn Profile https://www.linkedin.com/company/tuskerdirect/ 2. Tusker's Facebook Page https://www.facebook.com/Tuskerdirect/ 3. Tusker's YouTube Page https://www.youtube.com/@Tuskercarscheme/ 4. Tusker's Instagram Page https://www.instagram.com/tuskercars/ 5. Tusker's Trust Pilot Page https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/tuskerdirect.com/ 1. ^ "Tusker — Drive a better car through Salary Sacrifice". Tusker. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 2. https://www.lloydsbankinggroup.com/who-we-are/our-brands/tusker.html Lloyds Banking Group. Retrieved May 30, 2023. 3. ^ "Lloyds Banking Group acquires low emission vehicle leasing company Tusker". Lloyds Banking Group. Lloyds Banking Group. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 4. ^ "CPC Drive - Vehicle Leasing and Salary Sacrifice Scheme (NOE.0524)". NOE CPC. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 5. ^ "Investment Portfolio". Smedvig Capital. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 6. ^ "Tusker introduces new green initiatives". Fleet News. September 1, 2014. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 7. ^ "Success for Tusker StopGap cars scheme". Fleet News. November 30, 2012. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 8. ^ "Tusker". ECI Partners. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 9. https://www.fleetnews.co.uk/fleet-leasing/news/latest-fleet-leasing/2018/04/19/tusker-appoints-new-ceo . Fleet News. October 9, 2015. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 10. ^ "Tusker extends Fleet Assist contract for three more years". Fleet News. August 5, 2020. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 11. ^ "Tusker to assist EV switch with Diode partnership". Fleet News. February 10, 2021. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 12. ^ "Tusker joins nationwide procurement framework as sole supplier". Fleet News. February 12, 2019. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 13. ^ "Reward Gateway Announces Salary Sacrifice Partnership with Tusker". Employee Benefits. November 26, 2020. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 14. ^ "Tusker now net positive contributor to environment after 11 years of carbon neutrality". EV Fleet World. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 15. ^ "BVRLA helps MPs #SeeTheBenefit". BRVLA. July 21, 2022. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 16. ^ "WSBA Awards 2022". WSBA Awards. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 17. ^ "Results 2021". e-mobility awards. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 18. ^ "CRSA Awards" (PDF). CRSA Awards. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 19. ^ "Tusker". Acquisition International. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 20. ^ "Tusker". Acquisition International. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 21. ^ "Tusker". Acquisition International. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 22. ^ "AI 2018 Business Excellence Awards". Acquisition International. Retrieved April 6, 2023. 23. ^ "Fleet World Honours 2017". Fleet World. Retrieved April 6, 2023.

81.145.187.130 (talk) 09:58, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi, and welcome to the Teahouse. Where was your old draft article that was rejected? And where is your new draft article? Esowteric + Talk + Breadcrumbs 10:21, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

This appears to be User:Tusker Cars evading their block. Their draft was deleted as promotional. ColinFine (talk) 10:36, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Enabling IP information tool

how to enable this feature? Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 13:24, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@hypersonic man 11: preferences > beta > ip information lettherebedarklight晚安 13:27, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

thx Hypersonic man 11 (talk) 12:13, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

I'd like to start a discussion about collecting and world records. Where would be the best place to do this?

I'd like to start a discussion about collecting and worlds records. I had some articles deleted in regards to these, and I think a larger discussion needs to be had. I'd like to know where this discussion should take place.

Thanks KatoKungLee (talk) 14:59, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@KatoKungLee There is a category page Category:Records (superlatives). I suggest you look at some of the articles in there and then at the Talk Page(s) of any that seem relevant to you. Those Talk Pages should list the WP:PROJECTS interested. Using a relevant project talk page might be a good place for your discussion. You could leave a message on other Project talk pages to say where you are centralising the discussion. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:14, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Uncertainty about the validity of creating a new Wikipedia article

Hi,

I wish to create a new Wikipedia article which is a collection of facts about an existing UK-based amateur barbershop music group.

I seem to recall I tried creating such a Wikipedia resource a few years ago but perhaps it was taken down by moderators. This would have only been because it was either not notable and/or lacked third-party validation/citation (sorry, cannot remember the details any more).

I now want to have another attempt at creating the article but, this time, I want to make sure I prepare better, listen to the experts, and be ready for issues before they happen so that I don't waste time on an article which gets rejected.

As such, I felt it would be a good idea to base my own article on others which DO seem to have stood the test of time in that they still exist - so presumably conform to Wikipedia rules. For instance:

Hallmark of Harmony

Alexandria Harmonizers

What I would like to do is to pretty much follow the same content and style of these to introduce another barbershop group on the basis that, if these other articles are acceptable, then mine will be too.

So my question to Teahouse is simply this: what is it specifically about these other two articles which means that they conform to the accepted standards for articles in terms of notability, validity, citation, and so on ? Or, to turn it on its head, what do they NOT say which would otherwise cause moderators to ask for changes ?

Thank you for any replies. Gazroobari (talk) 15:09, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@gazroobari: those articles are bad. don't base your article off of those. it's unfortunately quite common that old and poor quality articles like these are swept under the radar.

as for our standards on articles, this page contains everything you need to know about creating an article. lettherebedarklight晚安 15:13, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@gazroobari: The easiest way to tell if anything is notable or not is by doing various google searches, Google Books searches and newspapers.com searches. If the group you want to write about has a lot of articles on them by major mainstream media sources, it's probably worth writing about. If your topic of interest just has sources that were made on personal websites or databases, it's probably not suitable under current rules.KatoKungLee (talk) 15:17, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@Gazroobari There is a useful essay at this link about how to approach drafting your article. There is a rather harsh assessment at WP:GARAGE that is nevertheless worth reading too. Mike Turnbull (talk) 15:21, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

maps

hello there -

i'm wondering if anyone knows about the maps on Wikipedia - specifically, the tech behind them. when i've enlarged the maps (across several devices), the indicator dot disappears on the enlarged map. the enlarged maps to which i'm referring are of the area including the dot indicator on the initial, unenlarged map.

somehow i found my way here, and that map issue has long been on my radar. so i'm here to map out my study on behind the scenes Wikipedia with that.

any direction is appreciated - either to an entity here to fix this or to training that might address this.

thank you, Beth. Hirbey (talk) 15:32, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@Hirbey, welcome! If you get no better reply here, WP:MAPS may have some of what you want. You can also try asking at Wikipedia talk:WikiProject Maps. Gråbergs Gråa Sång (talk) 17:36, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Why no original research on Wikipedia?

Although Wikipedia is an encyclopedia about adding new information and adding content with sources cited, I know that it is an tertiary source. However, would you please explain why Wikipedia is not a place to add unreviewed research and original research to these articles? Why is that rule added in 2003? What are the only cases you can add original research in these articles? Thank you again. /EnjoyBrowser557 (userpage) (talk) (contributions) 17:02, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@enjoybrowser557:

would you please explain why Wikipedia is not a place to add unreviewed research and original research to these articles?

because this was how wikipedia was decided to be.

What are the only cases you can add original research in these articles?

never. lettherebedarklight晚安 17:06, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

should probably add my 2 cents that only might derail this whole conversation before it inevitably gets closed

wikipedia's main role is to mention things that happen, how reliable sauces say they happen

if it did allow opinions and original research, there wouldn't be much incentive for saucing things, and this could very well devolve into a clone of tv tropes with slightly different formatting

could mention how this is related to trying to avoid coi editing, but that's going off-track cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 18:03, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

...sourcing, not saucing

i can't believe i made this mistake again cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 18:04, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

well, the op is blocked indef... lettherebedarklight晚安 18:05, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

that's

not an outcome i can say i expected from this situation cogsan • (give me attention) • (see my deeds) 18:07, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Because the editors decided amongst themselves Wikipedia should describe what exists in the world outside Wikipedia and not what is in the heads of the editors and not include arguments made by editors.

Wikipedia aims to be apolitical/centrist through enforcement of WP:NPOV, allowing users to make novel arguments and conclussions would undermine this, as basic as they might seem.

it also helps argue against people editing their own pages or inserting facts without citation.Bart Terpstra (talk) 18:51, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

The key to Wikipedia is that anyone can edit (except, apparently, now, not the person who started this discussion), but statements of fact must be verified by reliable source references. “You are entitled to your opinion. But you are not entitled to your own facts.” ― Daniel Patrick Moynihan David notMD (talk) 19:04, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

What is a fact, reliable or notable are things that are created by social consensus of editors/by those with power.

They generally attempt to do this following the beliefs codified in the guidelines.

"There are no facts, only interpretations."

-Friedrich Nietzsche Bart Terpstra (talk) 19:16, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Having looked up the quote, it's funny you credit the person who popularized it, rather than the person who said it first or whom the credited person gives credit to for the phrase.

hitting home the point about subjectivity of facts XD Bart Terpstra (talk) 19:41, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

how do you add a page

wanting to add a page for dextromethamphetamine which does not yet exist, and if you click the link to it, it'll link to the racemic meth page.

there's two isomers in meth, levo and dextro, which both together in equal amounts make racemic methamphetamine. dextrometh is known to be the more active isomer, responsible for most of the euphoric clean recreational effects. yet, even though structurally dextrometh is a different drug from racemic, there's no page for it, and the 'page' for it just links back to the normal meth page which is kinda annoying. how do you add a page? Doxylamine (talk) 17:02, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@Doxylamine Hello! If you are sure that this topic is notable, I would suggest creating a draft article for "Dextromethamphetamine" and when it is ready for the main namespace you can make a technical move request. Or alternatively, you can make a draft in your personal sandbox and then copy and paste it over the current redirect. Apmh 17:13, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@Doxylamine I see that you have already started a discussion of this on the article's Talk Page. As Methamphetamine is classified as a good article, the issue of whether a fork is needed to the specific dextro compound has been discussed before and some are now archived. You need to seek consensus before working on a new draft, or you may be wasting your time. See chiral drugs for some of the chemical background. The dextro isomer would clearly be notable but that's not the issue in my opinion. Mike Turnbull (talk) 17:38, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

How do I start a wiki project?

I noticed wikiprojects seem surprisingly informal so I was thinking of starting a niche wikiproject dedicated to developing years in jazz articles or more broadly years in music if thats too specific. Is this a good idea for a wikiproject and if so how do I start one. It would be related to WP:Jazz and WP:YEARS Carolina Heart (talk) 19:21, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Instead of starting a new project why not work within the existing projects? 331dot (talk) 19:24, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Was thinking I could direct an increased activity to those pages with other editors Carolina Heart (talk) 19:41, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@Carolina Heart I think @331dot is right. It's too niche, and could be done within WP:JAZZ. You could raise the idea there and link to it at WP:YEARS. Unless you have a few other editors with a genuine and seriously-expressed interest in working with you in that very topic area, it would be unwise to attempt to create a new WikiProject as it would soon die a death if there was not enough enthusiasm to sustain it. If you can't find those editors, then just continue working as you have been doing to improve those 'year' articles. Regards, Nick Moyes (talk) 19:41, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Ah, ok Carolina Heart (talk) 19:42, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Carolina Heart and welcome to the Teahouse, I agree with @Nick Moyes and @331dot I wouldn't want you to spend so hard on something just for it to die. Jack345110 (talk) 20:51, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Narrow focus is a commonplace error. Someone once started a Wikiproject about Higher Education in New York. I figured since there was not much happening in possible parental Wikiprojects such as Higher Education or New York, it was doomed. It indeed came to nothing. So, the place to ask is in the parental Wikiprojects where you would ask whether discussion about your topic is getting out of hand, growing so large that it interferes with other matters. Usually the answer is no. Cast your net large, and you might catch something good; a narrow net will net little if anything. Jim.henderson (talk) 22:57, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

What hatnote would be the most appropriate to place here?

Forgive me for my inexperience with hatnotes, but I'm unsure which one to add to Joose.

I want to add a hatnote informing people that there's a band that Jack Stauber is in that has the same name.

It currently has the following hatnote:

This page is about the malt beverage. For the JavaScript-Framework, see Joose (framework).

Would this be appropriate?:

This page is about the malt beverage. For the JavaScript-Framework, see Joose (framework). For The band, see Jack Stauber.

--QuickQuokka ^{[⁠talk • contribs]} 20:51, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

Helo, QuickQuokka. In my opinion, that is not an appropriate use of a hatnote; but I confess I cannot find the case discussed in WP:HATNOTE. ColinFine (talk) 20:56, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

@QuickQuokka: Welcome to the Teahouse. It doesn't seem the band he was in has an article of its own, so there's no point in linking to Jack Stauber, where Joose is mentioned only once in the lede. I'd keep it as is. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 22:04, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

How do I make a page in Wikipedia

I don't know how to make a page in Wikipedia, can you tell me how? TheReaperScythe1 (talk) 23:13, 30 May 2023 (UTC)

hi @TheReaperScythe1 and welcome to the Teahouse! what do you want to create an article about? before starting one, I recommend you read Notability (on what can get an article), Reliable sources (on what can be used to source the claims in your article), and Your first article (on writing the article itself). happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 00:07, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Please click and read this - the same applies to you.-1Firang (talk) 00:13, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Creating a link in the edit summary

In this edit, I was unable to create a link to what I wanted people to go and read, if they chose to (a particular section of the, "Talk page"), so please let me know how to create a link correctly in the edit summary.-1Firang (talk) 00:06, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

hi @1Firang and welcome to the Teahouse! the link you have created, Talk:Coerced religious conversion in Pakistan/Lower Protection to EC., links to a subpage of Talk:Coerced religious conversion in Pakistan that doesn't exist. the right way to link to subsections of a page is by using hashes: Talk:Coerced religious conversion in Pakistan#Lower Protection to EC. links to the relevant talk page discussion. happy editing! 💜  melecie  talk - 00:12, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you!-1Firang (talk) 00:16, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

So what if I want to link to a subsection? Will Talk:Coerced religious conversion in Pakistan#Lower Protection to EC.#Achieving consensus work?-1Firang (talk) 00:40, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@1Firang: No, but Talk:Coerced_religious_conversion_in_Pakistan#Achieving_consensus should work. RudolfRed (talk) 00:43, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Thanks a lot (it does)!-1Firang (talk) 00:46, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Plagiarism found in this article

Link: Ellesmere Park High School

I have found a specific section in this article which literally copies word for word from this website. The following passage from the article can be seen here:

"Local Education Authorities were required to submit proposals to the new Department of Education for reorganising secondary schooling in their areas.

Most LEAs aimed to establish the three main 'streams' or categories of school - grammar, secondary modern and technical - which had been recommended in a Report by Sir William Spens in 1938.

Children would be allocated on the basis of an examination at the age of 11, known as the Eleven-Plus. This was intended to provide equal opportunities for children of all backgrounds, though in reality this did not happen. LEAs were not co-ordinating and so percentage rates of passes were deemed inconsistent; and some would have leanings towards more passes for boys than girls despite girls proving the more intelligent at these younger ages, whilst the boys tended to overtake them later. The overall apportionment of places was deemed to be unfair.

Also, the school leaving age was raised to 15, though the stated intention that it should be 16 was not effected until 1972."

Most of the text shown here is plagiarized, and would it be wise to delete it on sight? Thanks, TrademarkedTarantula (talk) 05:02, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi TrademarkedTarantula. It would probably better for you to follow the guidance in Wikipedia:Text copyright violations 101 since deleting the content from the current version of the article is unlikely to be all that needs to be done. An administrator may need to go through the article's history and hide any versions which include the same content. Finally, it's also probably not a good idea to repost everything again on other pages because you're just making more things to clean up if it's truly plagiarism. -- Marchjuly (talk) 05:28, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Difference

What is the Difference between Austria and the Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic— Preceding unsigned comment added by Santaclaus1993 (talk • contribs)

Santaclaus1993 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. We have an article on Austria, but no article on a "Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic", probably because Austria was never part of the Soviet Union. I'm not clear on what your question is. 331dot (talk) 08:37, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

I wrote the above in response to your original posting. You're asking what the difference is- one existed, the other didn't. This page is for asking questions about using Wikipedia, general questions should be asked at the Reference Desk. 331dot (talk) 08:38, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Where could I create the arcticle of Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic ? — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santaclaus1993 (talk • contribs) 08:46, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

it doesn't exist. don't. lettherebedarklight晚安 08:49, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Santaclaus1993 (ec) New accounts cannot directly create articles. Creating new articles is the most difficult task to attempt on Wikipedia, and as such we usually recommend that new users first gain experience and knowledge by using the new user tutorial and then editing existing articles in areas that interest them, to get a feel for how Wikipedia operates and what is expected of article content. However, if you still want to attempt to create a new article, you may use the article wizard.

Very curious as to what you will be writing about since as far as I know there has never been an entity called the "Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic". What sources do you have? 331dot (talk) 08:51, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

lettherebedarklight Things don't have to exist to have an article about them- but there must be coverage in reliable sources. 331dot (talk) 08:54, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

I have source about there was an Allied-occupied Austria. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santaclaus1993 (talk • contribs) 08:56, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Santaclause1993 But that is not a "Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic". Austria was never part of the Soviet Union. 331dot (talk) 08:58, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Beside the Austrian Soviet Socialist Republic, I would also like to create arcticles about the East German Soviet Socialist Republic and the Norwegian Soviet Socialist Republic — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santaclaus1993 (talk • contribs)

Santaclaus1993 None of those things have ever existed or even attempted to exist, I think. We have an article on East Germany as well as Soviet occupation zone of Germany; it was never incorporated into the Soviet Union. You are a long ways from creating articles effectively and I suggest that you not attempt it until you are more familiar with our guidelines. 331dot (talk) 09:09, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Editor now indefinitely blocked. David notMD (talk) 13:22, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

WP:SELFCITE

Hello, so far I have never cited any of my published articles. Some of them are published in peer-reviewed academic journals. I was wondering, if I were to cite them, would I be required to disclose my identity on the article talk page or elsewhere? Per WP:SELFCITE, You will be permanently identified in the page history as the person who added the citation to your own work. Does this mean that I should disclose a WP:COI? Thank you for letting me know, Gitz (talk) (contribs) 09:13, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Gitz6666 Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. Yes, if you intend to make edits citing your own work, you should disclose a conflict of interest. 331dot (talk) 09:14, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you for the prompt reply. This clarifies the issue: I've never cited my work in the past and will never do so in the future. However, I'd suggest we write this explicitly in the relevant guideline. E.g., WP:SELFCITE could be Using material you have written or published is allowed within reason, but only if the conflict of interest has been disclosed and the material is relevant, conforms to the content policies, including WP:SELFPUB, and is not excessive. Shall I go for a bold edit or am I wrong? Gitz (talk) (contribs) 09:22, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

I would suggest that you propose your edit at Wikipedia talk:Conflict of interest, the talk page for that policy. 331dot (talk) 09:27, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Note that disclosure of unpaid COI is a "should", not a "must". So your proposed wording requires more than the policies require. Nevertheless, I agree with your change in principle. ColinFine (talk) 09:31, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Thank you again for your suggestions. The thread is here. Gitz (talk) (contribs) 09:35, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Publication of books

There are three books that/ which ought to be published: What is the criterion for the same. 197.250.225.233 (talk) 09:19, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello and welcome to the Teahouse. By "ought to be published" I assume you are speaking about creating articles for them. The crieria for books to meet in order to merit an article may be found at WP:NBOOK. You will need to gather at least three independent reliable sources to summarize in any article about a book. Writing a new article is very difficult, please see Your First Article. If you create an account, you may use the new user tutorial to learn more about Wikipedia and what we are looking for. 331dot (talk) 09:21, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

(e/c) This is a page for help with using and editing Wikipedia. We do not publish books. You would need to find yourself a publisher or publish them yourself. Shantavira|^{feed me} 09:25, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

no. lettherebedarklight晚安 09:48, 31 May 2023 (UTC)
The following discussion has been closed. Please do not modify it.
Why is China trying to take over the world why are there so many Chinese? Santaclaus1993 (talk) 09:30, 31 May 2023 (UTC) The Teahouse is not for this type of question. 331dot (talk) 09:44, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Converting

How to make a basic picture to become a Wikipedia pic? Santaclaus1993 (talk) 09:57, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@Santaclaus1993: what is a "Wikipedia pic"? -- DoubleGrazing (talk) 10:01, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Wikipedia picture for sharing to Wikipedia. — Preceding unsigned comment added by Santaclaus1993 (talk • contribs) 10:02, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@Santaclaus1993 Pictures you have taken with your own camera or images you personally have created should be uploaded to our sister Project, Wikimedia Commons, and licensed there for anyone to use, including within Wikipedia articles. Please click on this link for the full instructions. Mike Turnbull (talk) 10:28, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

 Note: OP has been blocked. —Tenryuu 🐲 ( 💬 • 📝 ) 13:52, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Notices are the top of an article about to be edited

I notice that some articles have "page notices" that appear at the top when editing the page (e.g. like on List of climbers and mountaineers). Am I, an ordinary editor, able to create such notices, or is that for an administrator? thanks. Aszx5000 (talk) 11:17, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@Aszx5000 That notice comes from a template {{Editnotices/Page/List of climbers and mountaineers}} which happens to have been created by an admin. Template creation is a bit of a specialist art but I don' t think there is any requirement that such templates be made only by admins. Mike Turnbull (talk) 11:23, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@Aszx5000, Michael D. Turnbull I am afraid that this is incorrect. All editnotices, that is, pages under Template:Editnotice/, are automatically protected by the title blacklist. See Wikipedia:Editnotice for more info. Victor Schmidt mobil (talk) 12:38, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@Victor Schmidt mobil Apologies, I was confused since some such templates are made by non-admins like pagemovers and template editors. Mike Turnbull (talk) 12:45, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Help; IDK how to make a article

Hi i know what you're thinking, but i do not understand how to use the article wizard or any help article. You, Wikipedians could make 400 children happy by helping me make this article. I am entirely greatful if you could help me make: Birch Hill Primary School. I can give details and facts. Thank you.

IGotHacked12 (talk) 11:42, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Hello @IGotHacked12! What about the article wizard do you not understand? (You can find it at Help:Your first article if this is your question) Apmh 12:32, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

After you read WP:YFA as suggested by Apmh, I would suggest also WP:BACKWARD. - UtherSRG (talk) 12:48, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@IGotHacked12 I assume that you are planning to write about the school that you attend in Bracknell. It is relatively unlikely that your school is notable in the way that Wikipedia requires. Please read that linked article or you may be wasting your time trying to draft something. You cannot base a draft on information you happen to know about the school, only on what has been published elsewhere in reliable sources meeting these golden rules. Mike Turnbull (talk) 13:04, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Guides

Hello hosts! I got a reply a while back on the Teahouse for guides. I knew all of the stuff in there. By any chance do you know a few advanced Wikipedia guides? (That are up to date)

Thanks in advance! Wikihelper59 (talk) 13:34, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @Wikihelper59, welcome to the Teahouse. Advanced guides here on Wikipedia tend to be specific rather than general (Help:How to move a page, Help:How to write the perfect "Did you know" hook, etc.). Is there a specific area you're interested in? 199.208.172.35 (talk) 14:26, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Help!

Firsteval thanks for the invitation guys! I wrote an article and I was working for hours but it was unfortunately deleted. Currently, I am writing another article about a another person. I do not want the deletion order to be repeated with me. Is there anyone here who can help me in checking and improving the article? Normally I can write good enough because I am a developer :/, but it seems that writing on Wikipedia requires special skills. MarkScoopit (talk) 13:51, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

Hi @MarkScoopit, welcome to the Teahouse. Do you mean the draft at User:MarkScoopit/sandbox? 199.208.172.35 (talk) 14:22, 31 May 2023 (UTC)

@MarkScoopit: You would do well to read these essays on article creation: WP:YFA, WP:BACKWARD, WP:42. Failing to heed the advice in them will likely result in your attempts being deleted again. - UtherSRG (talk) 14:29, 31 May 2023 (UTC)